Fair trade and ethical 'social stock exchange' planned. What do you think?

[Jill]

When we had the theme on Fairtrade fortnight I got quite concerned with ethical and fairtrading issues and decided to put up some adverts on the site promoting companies with ethical policies.

But only £1 out of every £250 spent is on Fairtrade goods. Does this mean most trade is unfair? How much child labour is being used? What about sweatshop conditions involving long hours and wages lower than the cost of living? Do we expect business to maximise profits regardless of how they go about this or do we want to see more responsible and ethical organisations in business.

The article below got me thinking about these issues again. Plans to create a seperate social stock exchange for fairtrade and ethical businesses mean we accept the majority of businesses will not be fair trade or ethical. Can this be right?

Will be interested to hear your opinions in this area. Here is the article:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article3603039.ece

Plan for fair trade stock exchange
Marie Woolf

Fair trade brands and ethical enterprises – such as Jamie Oliver’s restaurant Fifteen – could be listed on a new “social stock exchange” under plans being drawn up by the government.

Ministers are working on proposals for an ethical investment bank, supported by hundreds of millions of pounds lying in dormant bank accounts, and a stock exchange where social enterprises and environmental ventures raise cash.

The blueprint, being drawn up by the Cabinet Office with help from the Rockefeller Foundation, would aim to make London the international centre for ethical investors and fair trade firms.

Phil Hope, the Cabinet Office minister responsible for the voluntary and social enterprise sectors, will this week announce proposals for the ethical stock exchange.

The ethical investment bank would be funded by an estimated £250m from money in dormant bank accounts which, under a law being pushed through parliament, can be claimed by the state and reinvested in social projects. The stock exchange would allow firms that plough cash into community ventures to raise cash.

Investors could pump cash into organisations such as fair trade coffee and chocolate firms, housing cooperatives and other enterprises that make profits yet also have a social or environmental objective.

Among firms that would be able to raise capital are Fifteen, which trains disadvantaged young people to be chefs, and Terra Plana, an eco-friendly shoe brand that uses recycled car tyres and rice husks in the manufacture of its Worn Again shoes.

There are more than 55,000 social enterprises in the UK generating about £27 billion a year. One such is the Big Issue magazine which enables homeless people to earn money by selling the publication on the streets.

[Katherine Haynes]

I'm a bit late joining this discussion, but I'd just like to head it back to the origional topic of fair trade/ ethical stuff. (the food in schools thing is important, but they basically found out you are what you eat - not all that surprising)

If you want more info on fairtrade visit www.fairtrade.net (or it might be .org at the end) and if you have any questions email them and they will get back to you
They also have links to the fairtrade labeling organisation, and the soil association and other websites to do with Fair trade, organic, and other ethical issues

I'm not sure of a need for a whole new ethical stock market, I tried to sort out an isa type thing and was offered an option to invest only in ethical companies, it was with L&G through Nationwide if anyone's interested.

As far as Fair Trade is concerned, I volunteered at the Fairtrade Foundation in London for a year, and it was very clear that the money was getting to the right people. It's all very well saying give charity personally so you know where it goes but it takes a large orgainisation to get the message to the population in general, and regulate it all so that we can be sure of what we're paying extra for. The more people that know about fair trade, the people that want it. The more people that want fair trade the more companies want to supply it, so the more fairtrade stuff needs to be produced, so the more farmers etc benefit. Eventually, fairtrade products will need to be mass produced (I know for example Sainsbury's only stocks bananas and roses that are fairtrade). This will mean that eventually the prices will come down.

Of course shops are going to add their own bit of profit to the cost of Fairtrade/organic goods - they do it to all their goods! That is how capitalism works - noone is going to sell things on at cost price, there would be no point. How many of those with work in the sales room have done that?

The supermarkets vs local shops/farmers markets etc is another argument altogether.
A lot of the unethical working conditions comes as a result of government subsidies as subsidised farmers can afford to sell their produce for less, forcing the unsubsidised ones to compete with the result of low pay and poor working conditions.

The John Lewis group, which I believe includes Waitrose? is a bit of a tricky one as yes they comply to ethical product standards but many of them are not the same standards as set by the Fairtrade Foundation and FLO so those products cannot hold the Fairtrade Mark, and in following their own rules undermine the the whole system.

Yes, the government want to get their hands on more money - they too are in more debt than ever from, amoungst other things, public spending. Our society needs public spending to survive and improve, so you are doing yourself a disservice to begrudge the government any money at all. Ok so they haven't been particularly efficient with their spending and made bad choices along the way, but we voted them in, all we can do is vote them out again!

As for the whole vending machines/sponsorship war in US and Canadian schools - I didn't realise it was still going on! I presume you have read Naomi Klein's 'No Logo', and the various other books in this vien that followed? If not, do so.

[Jill]

Hi Katherine

Yes you are right this discussion has veered around a lot of different angles and areas.

I'm interested to know you volunteered with the Fairtrade Foundation. They seem to be doing a good job getting the Fairtrade message across. I get a Fairtrade Google alert each day and it is full with different items about Fairtrade events taking place all the time. Also they seem to be sucessful in getting some big companies to sign up. Even Tate and Lyle sugar is going fairtrade soon I think.

Anyway I am in a bit of a rush at the moment but will come back to all this again later.

Bye for Now
Jill

[Katherine Haynes]

I got into Fairtrade at uni, and did my thesis on it focusing on textiles. I then decided to finish my Duke of Edinburgh Gold award and that's why I volunteered at the Fairtrade foundation. You are right about Tate and Lyle, although its actually the FLO that does that side of things. The foundation works to make new products fairtrade. When I stopped going they were beginning the (long) process of working out obtainable but fair standards for linen amongst other things due to the success of Fairtrade cotton.

[Jill]

Hi

Oh that is fascinating Katherine. So you saw behind the scenes and think they are doing a good job. I have noticed an increase in fairtrade cotton clothes around but I don't think it is possible to buy just the material which would be good for people making crafts. I may be wrong on that though.

In general I have said before in this discussion that I think all trade should be fair really but at least Fairtrade is a step in the right direction towards improved conditions of work and pay for some. Some people on low incomes can't afford to pay the extra for Fairtrade but I think it is worth it when you can. I got Fairtrade easter eggs this year that were not much more expensive than the cheapest in the supermarkets would have been but at least I could read on the packet that the chocolate company was 40% owned by the Fairtrade cooperative workers and how much the system helped the people build up their community. It made me feel better to know that they were not being exploited and as a consumer I would like to be able to feel that way about everything I buy really.
I didn't know John Lewis/Waitrose set their own standards rather than join in Fairtrade ones. I wonder why they do that? I use their shopping delivery people Ocado and much prefer them to other supermarkets but will maybe look up and see what they say about their fairtrade policy.

Anyway thats quite a bit more to think about in your posts Katherine so thanks.

Bye for Now
Jill

[Katherine Haynes]

Fairtrade cotton is not widely available by the metre, but I know you can get it from Bishopston Trading Company if anyone is interested. I don't think they sell an undyed one, but whatever they have left over from the previous year's colours they sell off by the metre. They have a wide range of colours and some checks and stripes as well as plain colours.

[Jill]

Hi

That is useful to know that you can get Fairtrade cotton by the metre from this company. This made me think maybe we need a 'good suppliers' section somewhere.

Bye for Now
Jill

[Katherine Haynes]

Yes that is a very good idea

[Jill]

Hi

Ok I will put up a discussion for listing some good suppliers and include

the Bishopston Trading Company as the first entry.

Bye for Now

Jill